Copy cost estimation sap jobs

I am currently in need of comprehensive, multi-faceted telemedicine services to significantly enhance the accessibility, convenience, and cost-effectiveness of healthcare. Ideal candidates or companies for this project would possess: - Proven experience in the telemedicine field. - Examples of past work. - Detailed proposal showcasing their proposed approach to the project. Though the answers to what specific type of telemedicine service I'm looking for remain unanswered, a proficient provider should be equipped to offer a broad range of services, particularly in the following areas: - Virtual consultations - Remote patient monitoring - Diagnostic services Telehealth in New York. Must have providers onboard and has to be 100% compliant.

I am running amazon store in UAE and i am looking for someone who can help me product sourcing for my amazon store. Note: i don't want to source my product in Alibaba because the shipping cost is very costly for me Also, the seller have good experince in UAE market. Thanks

Construct a blog post for students based on the concepts you have learned about throughout this semester is either this...Pictures The blog post should be readable and visually appealing. You must include two original pictures with your blog post: either photos you take, or hand-drawings. Review the examples from The Learning Scientists Blogs Links to an external for examples of visually appealing content. Title Create an engaging title to attract readers. Format Type your blog post in a Word document and copy & paste the pictures into the appropriate location in the text. Length Your blog post should be 800-1,200 words long (not including the Title or References pages). Audience You are targeting College students, in particular those in the early stages of their educa...

We need freelancers who can handle data entry jobs and also type and retype our screenshots and documents perfectly… New freelancers are highly welcomed

...internal financial controls and procedures. Requirements: • Bachelor’s degree in Accounting, Finance, or related field. • Certified Public Accountant (CPA) or similar certification preferred. • Minimum of 5 years of accounting experience, particularly in a corporate setting. • Strong understanding of GAAP and financial reporting. • Proficient in accounting software (e.g., Xero, QuickBooks, SAP, Oracle). • Excellent analytical, problem-solving, and decision-making skills. • Strong attention to detail and ability to prioritize and manage multiple tasks. • Excellent communication and interpersonal skills. Benefits: • Competitive salary and comprehensive benefits • Opportunities for professional develo...

...placement, tracking, and confirmation. - Inventory Tracking: Real-time updating of inventory for an optimal supply chain management. - SAP Integration: Capability to integrate with our current SAP system for streamlined business operations. - Order Splitting: An option to divide order in case of large demand. - Truck Ordering: Enable easy booking and scheduling for transporting bulk orders. User Role: The app should be built primarily for an administrator role, with the potential to expand to supplier and customer roles in the future. Please note, prior background in developing applications in manufacturing industry will be advantageous. Familiarity with SAP integration is an absolute must. If your expertise aligns with my requirements, get in touch, and let�...

Perform an in-depth sensitivity analysis of a Pressure Swing Adsorption (PSA) process for CO2 capture using zeolite 13X. Scale up a CO2 capture system from a small-scale experimental study detailed in the attached research paper to an industria...experience in sensitivity analysis. - Strong understanding of Pressure Swing Adsorption processes. - Ability to interpret and implement mathematical equations from research papers. - Expertise in sensitivity analysis and scale-up projects. - Ability to translate experimental data into practical, large-scale applications. Goals: - Evaluate key metrics such as CO2 recovery%, purity, energy efficiency, and cost in various operational scenarios. I am looking forward to working with somebody who shares a passion for solving complex scientific...

I am looking for a detailed cost estimation for a residential construction projects. around 1500 estimates in the next 12 months. The estimation should include: - Material Costs: Please include a comprehensive breakdown of all material costs. - Labor Costs: An estimation of the labor costs required for the project. - Equipment Costs: Any expenses related to specialty devices or machinery. Skills and Experience: The ideal candidate would have expertise in construction estimating, specifically geared towards residential projects. A deep understanding of construction processes, material costing, labor costing, and equipment pricing is also essential. Attention to detail and accuracy are paramount for the success of this project.

...drop IKEA's items into the space and 'clicking' together before generating a CPQ and bill of materials. This will require the writing of 'rules' that suggest the user adds products that are necessary for the construction and use of some units. Research has also shown that customers responded well to items rendered in Unreal Engine or Unity. Please consider the cost of this within your quote, or suggest similar alternatives at a lower cost. Key Requirements: - The technology for the configurator should be based on 3D modeling and rendering, not AR or VR. This should mirror the style of IKEA's PAX Planner. - The configurator should be accessible across different platforms, including web browsers, mobile apps, and desktop applications. - We alr...

I need an experienced AutoCAD professional to convert 4 hand-drawn sketches to accurate, scaled engineering blueprints. Requirements: - The focus will be on creating basic outlines with dimensions, as opposed to full detail or annotations. - The sketches will need to include Mechanical Symbols. - Additionally, I need a PDF copy of each sketch, scaled to 11"x17" paper size. Ideal Skills and Experience: - Proficiency in AutoCAD for creating engineering blueprints. - Familiarity with Mechanical Symbols and notations. - Ability to work from basic hand-drawn sketches to generate high-quality, accurate plans. - Previous experience in creating scaled PDF copies would be an advantage.

I am currently in need of a talented copywriter with a solid background in technology. The main focus of this job will be: - Creating compelling copy for marketing materials. Skills and experiences needed for the job: - Exceptional writing and communication skills. - Deep understanding of the technology industry and its jargon. - Previous experience in copywriting specifically for marketing collateral. - Creativity in presenting complex concepts in an engaging and accessible manner. The ideal candidate is a passionate tech-savvy writer, capable of making our technology products/services appealing to our potential consumers through compelling marketing materials.

Integrated Al-Quran Education System Development Brief: Create a digital platform for Al-Quran education that features student progress tracking and transparent reporting. The system will utilize PHP Laravel, Flutter or .NET Core, with MySQL/MariaDB on a Linux server. Key Features: User registration for different roles: Admins, Teachers, Guardians, and Students. Payment options both online a...for different roles: Admins, Teachers, Guardians, and Students. Payment options both online and offline. Attendance and performance monitoring tools. Video tutorials for Quranic concepts. Requirements: Experience in educational technology. Quick turnaround and budget adherence. Deliverables: Complete web application. User guide and maintenance support. Proposal Needs: Approach, timeline, and ...

SAP BTP / Cloud Foundry DevOp's Create the CI/CD pipelines for a new application built in Java & React. Deploying on SAP BTP (similar to Cloud Foundry) Create release packages Time sensitive - start immediately

...for introducing our company. This will be integral in effectively communicating our brand identity, core values, and services to potential clients. I am looking for a skilful, experienced copywriter with a knack for crafting compelling narratives and a strong understanding of brand marketing. - Task Involves: * Thoroughly understanding our business model and ethos * Crafting compelling copy that effectively introduces our company * Revising content based on feedback, if any - Ideal Skills: * Proven experience in copywriting especially in corporate introduction * Exceptional writing and editing skills with attention to detail * Proficient in market research to understand audience preferences Your innovative thinking and creativity will enable us to put our b...

3D modeling of a villa in Revit: 1. Copy architectural model to construction: - Levels - Axes - Columns - Walls - Ceilings 2. Adding column sections - Wall sections - Beam sections 3. Connecting columns to ceilings 4. Linking beams to levels 5. Openings: windows and doors 6. Tables of quantities for concrete + blocks + iron.

...looking to establish a professional networking platform and natural mall shops in Italy. It is essential to have a detailed business plan for this operation within the next month. Key components of the business plan should include: - Market analysis: Understanding the market in Italy for professional networking platforms and natural mall shops. - Business model: Defining the revenue streams, cost structure and target customers. - Competitive analysis: Analyzing the competitors in the professional networking platform and natural mall shops space in Italy. - Marketing plan: Defining the marketing strategies to attract users and customers to the platform and shops. - Financial projections: Creating detailed financial projections including revenue, expenses, and cash flow for ...

Hi ! We are a company that specializes in AI film creation. We have few film projects in the works. Once we confirm we can work with you, there will be many AI film projects. To make sure we are a good fit. I want to show you a 30 sec. AI film clip for a project we would like to hire you to work on: A few shots are missing between the two scenes. (Starting from 12 sec) if you can show that you can create a prompt image or video that matches this scene for continuity, then we would like to invite you to work with us. We can work out the payment details once confirmed. Thank you. Here is the first page of the script. ***part is the missing part. Looking forward for your reply. I appreciate your interest. FADE IN: INT. THOMAS’S APARTMENT - MASTER

worked based on templates setup and change color upload 500 product on language change logo and color based business All app will be buy client as per needed I will add multi language app after by from client this is first scope for noe second scop will discuss later and cost will be different that one

...priceless works of art. Discuss with pre-teens the concept of value. How is value determined? What makes something historically or culturally significant? This helps them understand the concept of intrinsic value beyond just monetary worth. Museum Marketplace Math: If the museum has a gift shop, encourage pre-teens to browse and choose a souvenir they'd like. Challenge them to calculate the cost with tax and see if it fits within their budget created earlier. This reinforces practical math skills and responsible spending habits. Planting the Seeds of Organization and Time Management: Mission: Museum Master: Before your visit, encourage pre-teens to research the museum's collection and exhibits. Let them create a list of "must-see" items and plan ...

We are urgently developing a comprehensive marketing analytics tool designed to integrate data from various advertising platforms, website activity, CRM, and Marketing Automation Platforms (MAP) to provide a unified view of marketing performance. We require a highly skilled and efficient Data Engineer or Architect who can handle data export processes, model and create tables and entity relatio...Experience with cloud services such as AWS, Azure, or Google Cloud. - Background in data science or analytics. - Previous experience in marketing analytics or similar urgent projects. # Project Duration: - 1 month, with potential for follow-up enhancements based on project outcomes. # Budget: - Fixed-rate proposals preferred given the project urgency. Please include your proposed total project ...

I'm seeking a skilled professional to edit my website's content and undertake some marketing tasks. The website currently has less than 10 pages and needs editing for improved user experience and increased product information. The main tasks will include: - Refining text, including product descriptions, home page copy, and all policies to ensure they are up-to-date and enticing. - Ensuring the updated information is SEO-friendly, to help improve our search engine ranking. The ideal candidate will have a strong background in: - Web content editing and proofreading - SEO optimization - Marketing and user engagement tactics I'm looking for a freelancer who is ready to take on this project promptly and drive it to completion. Link of page

...reduce the time to process samples further. 5. What-if Scenario modelling a. Taking your further analyses from Tasks 4f and 4g as the basis for improving the model, construct 2-3 plausible scenarios that will improve the confidence that at least half of all samples from one week are processed in 24 hours or less. b. Modify at least two stages of the model (these must be reasonably unique – do not copy scenarios from others). c. Rerun simulation model with the same random number seed and compare results to that produced in Task 4. d. By plotting and comparing relevant probability distributions, explain how your modified scenario has reduced the time taken to process samples, and how it has impacted the likelihood of processing samples in under one day. 6. Insights and recom...

I'm looking for a detail-oriented Excel expert to amend certain elements on my existing spreadsheet. Key tasks include: Data Entry Corrections: - Correcting inaccuracies in data entries. - Rectifying data location errors. Data Reorientation: - Shifting the forma...Data Entry Corrections: - Correcting inaccuracies in data entries. - Rectifying data location errors. Data Reorientation: - Shifting the format from a vertical to a horizontal layout specifically for data values. It would be ideal if you possess a keen eye for detail, advanced Excel skills including formulas, and a proven track record of spreadsheet data management. Experience in handling large copy-paste tasks will also be of great advantage. Due to the nature of this task, a meticulous and systematic approach wi...

...developer, I'm looking for a skilled and creative architect to help me conceptualize a layout for a 5-hectare society. The goal is to craft a harmonious environment that integrates: • High-rise residential buildings (5+ floors): With your expert eye and creative design, we should offer a visually appealing and functional living space, taking into consideration aspects of safety, structural integrity, cost efficiency, and sustainability. • Outdoor recreational and functional areas: The project should incorporate well-designed playgrounds and parks, offering residents ample space for leisure and relaxation. Additionally, the plan should also ensure the organization of ample and efficient parking areas. Ideal candidates should possess: • Proven experience in ...

DESCRIPTION = = = = We need a skilled developer to create a mod for a future Minecraft SMP (Survival Multiplayer) server. The mod involves a small but crucial change to the game's hardcore aspect, allowing for easy toggling between hardcore mode and regular mode. PROJECT DETAILS = = = = - Objective: Modify Minecraft...completion. KEY POINTS = = = = We need a seamless transition between modes, with a toggle switch hidden from in-game messages. All players should have access to the toggle feature without entering creative mode. HOW TO APPLY = = = = If you have experience in Minecraft mod development and are interested in this project, please reach out to discuss further details and provide your estimated timeline and cost. We look forward to collaborating with you to bring th...

I'm in need of an experienced copywriter with a keen understanding of branding to help me create a promotional message for radio. The project's goal is to solidify our brand image in the eyes of businesses, therefore the tone must be professional. Key requirements include: - Understanding of branding strategies - Proficiency in creating professional and engaging copy - Specific experience in radio copywriting is a big plus

More details: What is the purpose of the copywriting project? Advertising copy Who is your target audience? Young adults (18-34) What tone should the advertising copy have? Casual and friendly

Overview: We are seeking a skilled UI/UX designer to create the design for a fantasy sports app. The app will provide users with an engaging platform to participate in various fantasy sports leagues and competitions. Key Features: Splash Screen: A visually appealing splash sc...Design mockups for splash screen, app opening screen, onboarding screens, and refer code screen. High-fidelity prototypes demonstrating user flow and interaction design. Any additional design assets required for development. Timeframe Please provide an estimated timeframe for completion of the project, including milestones for design iterations and final delivery. Cost: Please provide a detailed breakdown of the project cost, including any additional expenses such as licensing fees for design tools...

I'm intending to launch an online course aimed at enhancing the skills of sales professionals. To promote it effectively on platforms like YouTube and Facebook, I'm seeking a highly cost-effective, patient, and experienced individual proficient in crafting and managing ads. Requirements. 1) Help me create promotional video (advertisement) 2) Run the ads. 3) He/she will be responsible for analyticals and retargeting ads Start your bid with the amount you're bidding. For eg. If you are billing for $20, start your message with $20 and then write "Hi" Someone who is very patient with questions and willing to help me see my online course.

Do you want to convert any PDF, JPG, PNG, or image files Are you looking for any kind of document conversion or need editing in your documents, You are on the right gig. MY SERVICES: ✅ Data Entry ✅ Web research ✅ Data Conversion ✅ Copy Paste Work ✅ Excel Data Entry ✅ JPEG to Excel or Word ✅ PDF to Excel or Word ✅ Real Estate Data Entry ✅ Language Translator ✅ Microsoft Excel ✅ Microsoft Word ✅ Lead Generation If you still have any questions or want to discuss prices for a custom project, don't hesitate to contact me. WHY ORDER FROM ME?? Fast Delivery, Never Late ✔ Message me if you're unsure or have project-specific questions Thank you

I need help with scraping specific information from urls (we will provide). The key details I need are the company name and contact information. Website Phone Email Brand Country Of Origin Total Entries: 1704 No research required, you just need to copy paste information from the fields onto a google sheet.

I have a printed document that needs to be copied into a Google Docs format. The document contains images that will need to be included in the copy. Key Requirements: - Previous experience with copy typing printed documents - Proficiency in using Google Docs - Ability to effectively incorporate images into the document. Your attention to detail is critical for this project. Please ensure that the final document is an accurate representation of the original printed version.

I need to get a printed document copy-typed into a PDF file. The document contains both text and images. Key Requirements: - Convert a printed document into a PDF file. - Include images and graphics in the final copy. Skills and Experience Desired: - Proficient at copy typing. - Familiar with PDF file formatting. - Experience handling image and graphic inclusion in documents.

...included. Design Elements: Application of logo, typeface, and colors. 5. Email Signature Layout: Standard design and structure. Content: Required details to be included. Design Elements: Usage of logos, fonts, and colors. 6. Social Media Ads Templates: Create templates for major platforms (Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, Google AdWords). Text: Guidelines for typography in ad copy. Logo Placement: Defined rules for logo incorporation. 7. Company Letterhead Specifications: Layout for both header and footer. Design Elements: Consistent use of logo, typeface, and colors. 8. Marketing Materials General Requirements: Guidelines for flyers, posters, digital ads, and other promotional materials. Design Templates: Basic design templates for...

...to develop a Postnord module for my Opencart 3.0 website. The module should include functionalities like shipment tracking, shipping label generation, and estimated delivery time. Key Requirements: - Shipment tracking: ability to track package movements. - Shipping label generation: capability to generate shipping labels automatically. - Estimated delivery time: inclusion of delivery time estimation. Platform compatibility: This Postnord module needs to be compatible exclusively with the web platform. Prior experience with module development for Opencart 3.0 is necessary. Familiarity with Postnord's API and guidelines is considerably beneficial. The developer's problem-solving skills, meticulousness in coding, and attention to detail will be key to the successful co...

I have a project that requires the creation of a website on Webflow, populating it with text content only from a Word Document. The site structure will consist of 6 pages, which will need to be built out with an existing Webflow template – Sunshine Mind (). The pages are already made, just need to input the content. Landing page already created - Populate text content from Word Document into the given Webflow template. - Build out the following pages: Services Overview, Individual Service Pages, and About Us.

I am searching for ...achieve the project goals, the freelancer should have clear understanding of: • Developing and managing ads on Google, Facebook, and Instagram • Targeting specific demographics including age groups and geographic locations • Implementing interest categories targeting for better reach • Maximising Return On Investment (ROI) and Return On Ad Spend (ROAS) • Managing and Improving Cost Per Lead (CPL) and Cost Per Acquisition (CPA) metrics Skills and experience in digital marketing, campaign management, strategic planning, and ecommerce will be fundamental for the success of this project. A proven track record of similar projects with measurable outcomes is also essential. Seek professionals who are proven, results-driven,...

...online advertising campaign management firm and I urgently require a professional skilled in Tableau. Your task will be to create a comprehensive dashboard that assists me in analyzing and strategizing our sales operations. Key Deliverables: - Present crucial data points including daily ad impressions and conversion rates. - Display key performance indicators such as Click-through rate (CTR), Cost per acquisition (CPA), and Return on ad spend (ROAS). - Use different visualization formats like line charts, bar charts, and pie charts to represent the information. Ideal Skills: - Proficiency in Tableau - Strong analytical skills - Experience in developing dashboards with extensive understanding of marketing and sales KPIs. Please bid if you can deliver on these parameters. I loo...

We are looking for a native French person to transcribe a small 3 minutes long Canadian French video in French. We need the transcriptions in both .srt format and word document (you can copy paste from srt). Looking for someone who's experienced in French transcriptions and familiar with .srt subtitle format. New freelancers are welcome. Don't bid if you are not a native French speaker. Budget: 4 CAD fixed Need this to be done within 10 hours max after awarding the project. ***Don't bid if you are not happy with the price and deadline. Thank you!

I'm looking for a freelance vector artist to convert my file into an high quality AI format. The job is straightforward and only requires direct conversion. However, there are specific dimensions and resolution r...adept at working with Adobe Illustrator and experienced in maintaining high-quality resolution during the conversion process would be an excellent fit. We'll discuss the specifications once we begin the project. Your task is simple: - Convert the attached file into both AI and PDF format - Please provide the image in high resolution as it will be printed on a t-shirt Please bid with a time and cost estimate, and let me know if you need any more details. Proficiency in English is a bonus as it would aid our communication. Let's collaborate and comple...

As a growing business, I need a finance and accounting expert to assist me in streamlining our fi...helping me make informed decisions for the business. Ideal Skills and Experience: - Proven experience in accounting and finance, particularly in streamlining financial processes and creating accurate financial reports - Strong analytical skills, with the ability to interpret complex financial data and make recommendations based on your analysis - Experience working with tools like QuickBooks or SAP would be a big plus, but not a strict requirement. This project will be a great opportunity for someone who is a numbers whiz and has a keen eye for detail. If you're confident in your finance and accounting skills and have a track record of improving financial processes, I'd lo...

...is fertile farmland with endless water, fertile ground an a perfect environment for lifestyle farm blocks. The theme first made popular in New Zealand. I believe we need a “banner campaign: that encourages the viewer/reader to watch the video – We can test each of the three below Video Title URL-YouTube Artesian Water and Ponds In Arizona Avoid Tucson Water Cost Increase Colorado River Water Alternative The objective will be to get the person encouraged by the banner to watch the video and then for the individual to make a call or appointment to see the lots We need a call to Action and I want to promote development opportunities – acquire Riverbend Ranch, Lakeside Farms of Escalante Crossing

I'm urgently requiring a resourceful developer to create a tailor-made HR dashboard for our company. The developer should ideally have extensive experience in HR dashboard creation and a strong understanding of HR-related metrics. Key Features: - The dashboard should prominently feature recruitment metrics and performance evaluations. Recruitment Metrics Include: - Time-to-hire - Cost-per-hire Performance Evaluations Indicators: - Retention rate The dashboard should present these metrics in a clear, accessible format, preferably utilizing visually-pleasing graphs and charts. To excel at this project, the developer should have significant experience working on similar projects, a keen eye for design, and a knack for turning complex data into easy-to-understand visuals. A t...

I have a document that needs to be typed up. It's scanned, so you must be able to read and type from scanned documents. The document is in English, so fluency in English is essential. The final document should be in plain text format. Ideal Skills and Experience: - Fast and accurate typing skills - Experience in copy typing, particularly scanned documents - Proficiency in English language - Familiarity with converting documents to plain text format.

...campaigns. - Goals: The main aim of this campaign is to boost sales of my tour packages, so I am looking for someone who has experience in creating and managing high-converting campaigns. Your responsibilities will include: - Keyword Research: Identifying the most relevant and high-performing keywords related to tour packages in order to drive quality traffic. - Ad Creation: Crafting persuasive ad copy that highlights the unique selling points of my tour packages. - Campaign Optimization: Continuously monitoring and refining the campaign to maximize conversions and return on investment. Ideal Skills and Experience: - Proven experience in running successful Ads campaigns, particularly for travel or tour-related services. - Strong understanding of keyword research, ad copywrit...

I'm seeking an experienced typist for copy typing academic articles. An individual with a high school level of grammar and technical accuracy is ideal. In this project, the focus is mostly on the accurate and quick typing of the materials to digitize it, though attention to structure and layout is still important. Your responsibilities will include: - Accurate copy typing of the provided academic articles - Ensuring proper grammar and punctuation - Maintaining the original format of the documents Ideal skills: - Exceptional typing speed and accuracy - Basic understanding of academic articles - High school level grammar and technical knowledge - Attention to detail in regards to both typing accuracy and document layout.

...mission will be to educate potential customers about the benefits of purchasing directly from us as the sole importer, leveraging our competitive pricing and unmatched quality. Responsibilities: • Educate potential customers about the advantages of buying directly from us as the exclusive importer of pool heat pumps. • Utilize provided leads to identify and engage with pool owners, highlighting the cost savings and quality assurance of our products. • Customize sales pitches to address the unique needs and preferences of individual customers. • Establish trust and credibility by showcasing our track record of delivering exceptional value and customer satisfaction. • Close sales by effectively communicating the benefits of our direct importing model and a...

I'm looking for an experienced chatbot developer to create a user-friendly chatbot that can assist employment portal users in three main ways: - Answering Frequently Asked Questions (FAQs) - Recommending suitable job openings - Offering valuable resume tips The chatbot must be compatible with both our website and mobile application, ensuring seamless assistance to u...interactions, is preferred. we need advance AI Chatbot with C# programming language . We are developing a Naukri (Employment Portal) and needed this chatbot for same. This chatbot will be independent of website and will directly interact with database . Freelancer has to provide maintenance service for 1 year that means software must work 100% as per our description. There should be no extra cost for maint...

...system for me. The aim is to accurately measure the areas of house roofs using open source satellite imagery or other similar sources. This is so that the system can be used to estimate repair or replacement costs for specific regions. Key Responsibilities: - Train the AI to achieve high accuracy in measuring house roof areas - Ensure that the system is geared towards roof repair or replacement estimation - Focus on specific geographical regions for training data, tailored to my needs Ideal Skills and Experience: - Strong background in AI and machine learning - Experience in working with satellite imagery or similar data sources - Prior knowledge of training AI for specific applications, such as roof area measurement - Ability to create a flexible system that can be easily adap...

I’m trying to get a flyer done like this with this content: "Touch The Roadz bridges the gap between comfort and dental care excellence. As Molar City, Los Algodones, welcomes its visitors with the promise of top-tier dental services at a fraction of the cost, we ensure your journey is just as stress-free. From Arizona's doorstep to the world's dental capital, your transit is our command—for an unbeatable $127.77 round-trip. Secure your seat with Touch The Roadz, where affordability meets convenience, and embark on your journey to a brighter smile." The phone number is: +1 (833) 333-6798 The website is I would like the design of the flyer and within the flyer with the teeth and smile. Attached see both examples